Vox Populi

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Michael Simms: On the Spectrum with Garrison Keillor

I have a mild version of Asperger’s syndrome — also known as “high functioning autism.” Psychologists view Asperger’s not as a disease or disorder or neurosis, but rather as a common personality type. Although characteristics vary a great deal, people with Asperger’s tend to have problems with personal relationships because they, that is, we, tend to miss the visual and aural clues with which people signal their attitudes during conversation. We don’t intuitively see social boundaries, so we often offend people. We tend to be poor employees and not very good at marriage — thank God I’m married to Eva who is a psychologist, so she “gets” me.

In my case, I have a tendency to say things to people without understanding that what I’m saying is inappropriate or tactless or, in terms of my own career, simply stupid. Many of my friends and family members through the years have gotten angry at me for things I’ve said, and my tactlessness has at times caused problems in my relationships with poets I’m publishing. Pointing out that a poet’s drinking is the cause of his declining abilities; telling a celebrated poet that some of the poems in his new manuscript are not very good; suggesting to a college administrator, my boss at the time, that people know when she’s lying — these are just a few conversational missteps that I can now see were offensive, but at the time seemed the right things to say because they were true. Duh.

Fortunately, Asperger’s comes with compensatory talents; in fact, people with this tendency often have above average intelligence and an extraordinary ability to focus on a project over a period of years. Sometimes Asperger’s is called “the super-geek syndrome” because so many computer programmers have it. Also, you may have wondered about those weird guys (it’s more common in men than women) who spend twenty years building a mansion out of crushed beer cans or shivering night after night on a Scottish lake in order to photograph the Loch Ness monster. Yep. I could see myself taking on either of those projects.

Despite my problems in getting along with people, Asperger’s makes me an effective editor and entrepreneur. My unremunerated obsession with building Autumn House PressCoal Hill Review, and Vox Populi would not have been possible for a “normal” person. My bluntness about a manuscript’s strength and weakness and my obsessive re-writing of other people’s work — although some writers find these habits offensive — are often appreciated by poets. I’ve also been able to make money as a real estate and stock market investor because I’m not distracted by the noise of other people’s opinions.

When I started Autumn House Press (AHP) in 1998, Garrison Keillor was one of the first well-known literary figures to encourage my efforts. He picked up a number of AHP poems for his national radio broadcast The Writer’s Almanac. He was instrumental in bringing the work of Jo McDougall, George Bilgere, and Sue Ellen Thompson to a national audience – which helped establish their reputations and gave AHP a boost in sales. He also picked up two of my own poems. (Yay!) He loves to support independent presses from the heartland, and his tastes in poetry lean toward the romantic – Mary Oliver and James Wright are two of his favorite poets — so as editorial colleagues, we were a good match. I dealt mainly with his permissions editor, meeting Keillor only once briefly at a book signing, but he and I exchanged a few informal notes in which he was unfailingly courteous and encouraging.

Besides being a champion of accessible poetry and independent presses, Keillor was also an important literary advocate, bringing poetry into the mainstream of American popular culture, weaving poets into his nostalgic vision (some would say fantasy) of small-town America. His views became an influential part of a national conversation in the 1990’s about the reasons for the loss of a popular audience for American poetry. (Remember those articles in The Atlantic about the “death of American poetry?”) Dana Gioia, Ted Kooser, Keillor, and others argued that the modern and post-modern poets had lost touch with the traditional role of poets — using clear language and well-established forms to bring depth and meaning to the lives of ordinary people. According to this argument, poetry had become an intellectual game played by academics, and it was up to us to save it. I think that Gioia, Kooser, and Keillor were right to a certain degree, and their views helped to move poetry to the place where it is now – engaged, accessible, political, and increasingly popular. Poetry as an insider’s game seems to have run its course.

But putting aside for a moment my admiration for and gratitude to Keillor, it needs to be said that by most accounts, he is a difficult man. In 2017, charges of sexual harassment against him became public. Minnesota Public Radio (MPR) did an investigation and in January, 2018 claimed that Keillor had fostered a work environment that left some women feeling mistreated, sexualized, or belittled. He was fired from MPR, and his work for them, comprising 40 years of archives of Prairie Home Companion and The Writer’s Almanac, was taken off the website. No one, not even Keillor, was allowed access to the archives. 

After a few months, the scandal began to dissipate. The woman who charged Keillor with sexual harassment withdrew her claims without any payments being made to her. Other women he worked with came to his defense, and as details of Keillor’s behavior were revealed in the media, it became clear that he was not a rapist, or even a groper, but merely a bad boss. He belittled employees, men and women, for small mistakes. He was often moody, aloof and unresponsive. There were several instances over a 20 year period of Keillor making sexually inappropriate comments to employees, but they were not criminal in nature, just imaginatively creepy. For example, he wrote a limerick for Molly Hilgenberg and placed it on a white board behind the sales counter where she worked. Here’s the poem, for which Hilgenberg said Keillor later apologized:

A beauty who goes to Macalester ―

O, her face, her limbs, her ballast, her

Tiny blue kilt

And the way she is built

Could make a petrified phallus stir.

Questions were raised about the way that MPR’s top management had dealt with Keillor’s shortcomings. He was a brilliant performer, but a terrible boss. Why were his mistakes as a manager tolerated for so many years? 

The answer, of course, is that he was a cash cow for MPR, bringing in millions of dollars in donations, sponsorships, and distribution fees, so for decades the top management looked the other way, and when #Metoo happened, the management panicked, fired him, violated their contract with him, blocked access to his intellectual property, and embarrassed him publicly. Then, realizing that they had over-reacted, the management back-pedaled. A few months after Keillor was fired, the Executive Director of MPR made a vague public apology to him; he was awarded a cash settlement; access to his intellectual property was restored; and in exchange he promised not to sue MPR for defamation of character or breach of contract. 

Clearly, the management of MPR mishandled the situation at every stage, but those of us who’ve admired Keillor’s work have to ask: what the hell was he thinking?

I believe that Keillor’s inappropriate behavior through the years was caused by his autism. Keillor has been very open about being on the spectrum. For example, he spoke about his experiences as an autistic person in his keynote address at the 19th Annual Minnesota Autism Conference in 2014. His inability to make eye contact, his crippling shyness, his uncertainty of how to deal with women, his misinterpretation of social situations, his highly inappropriate remarks to just about everyone — are common traits of people with this condition. Also, his rich inner life, being able to create an entire world, the small town of Lake Wobegone, peopled by characters who themselves have rich inner lives and complicated relationships — his genius, if you want to call it that, also comes from his autism. This complicated man with his mix of talents and confusions got caught up in a national movement of women who were holding men accountable for generations of abuse. In Keillor’s case, it would have been better for everyone — and certainly less expensive for MPR — to have hired a therapist for Keillor when the problems first became apparent, rather than waiting until a crisis arose, and then publicly shaming him.

Among American poets, opinion about Keillor is divided. There are people like me who admire Keillor and feel grateful for what he has done for American poetry. Then there are others who believe that the sexual harassment charges should have been pursued more aggressively. And there are also critics who point out that he has often been dismissive of poets whose aesthetic is different than his own.

Take, for example, remarks Keillor made about the work of Marianne Moore, an icon of 20thcentury poetry. In the introduction to an anthology of poetry which he edited, he writes, “Marianne Moore was a dotty old aunt whose poems are quite replicable for anyone with a thesaurus. A nice lady, but definitely a plodder.” As a fan of Moore’s work, I find this characterization offensive, as have many of his readers. But I’m also puzzled by his attack on this much-admired poet. In the 1990s, Keillor read no less than eight of Moore’s poems on The Writer’s Almanac, so he must have admired her work at one time; why attack her later? The only explanation I can think of is that he thought it was funny to describe her in this way, and it’s typical of people on the spectrum to make jokes that are offensive, and then be genuinely surprised at the response.

Despite his gifts as a story-teller and his admirable service to the field of poetry, Keillor has sometimes failed to keep in mind the principle that I, as someone who is also on the autism spectrum, often fail to remember: our relationships with the people who are helping us are far more important than the mansions we are building out of crushed beer cans.

Copyright 2019 Michael Simms

Michael Simms is the founder of Vox Populi, Coal Hill Review, and Autumn House Press.

Garrison Keillor

23 comments on “Michael Simms: On the Spectrum with Garrison Keillor

  1. Margaret Haskens
    September 16, 2020

    As someone who used to work with Keillor – this analysis is right on the money, in my view. Thank you for putting it into words.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Vox Populi
      September 17, 2020

      Thanks, Margaret, for confirming that my description and analysis are accurate. Other people who have worked with Mr. Keillor have said similar things to me. However, I need to say as a person on the spectrum, I have a great deal of sympathy for him. Considering his autism, he has accomplished a great deal, and I admire him for it.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Margaret Haskens
        September 17, 2020

        It saddens me that none of the articles about his MeToo moment have mentioned his Autism. I wonder if they feared appearing as if they were “blaming” his behavior on a disorder. I, too, fear speaking out about it and being labeled as ableist. Because I myself am not on the spectrum, I don’t want to mischaracterize the experience.

        Liked by 1 person

        • Vox Populi
          September 17, 2020

          Well, evidently Keillor’s “sexual harassment” was confined to making a few stupid jokes over a period of decades, and women who had worked with him stepped up to defend him. People on the spectrum like me have problems with the hypersensitivity of people these days. We tend to be oblivious to micro-aggressions and we usually have an odd sense of humor that may appear politically incorrect.

          Liked by 1 person

  2. lawrence clark
    September 3, 2019

    Hi Michael. This is a personal message, not a comment. I nearly died of 2 infections, one hospital acquired after pneumonia. For a time I was comatose and out of my head but am now able to get around pretty well, and am working my way back, including spending time outside, cooking from scratch, negotiating a supermarket, slowly gaining back the weight I lost, etc. Being so ill for so long has been quite an experience. Without my family I would not have survived. Fortunately found a good physician down here. Enjoyed reading your comments about yourself. All the best to you and family. ruth

    Liked by 1 person

    • Vox Populi
      September 4, 2019

      Oh, Ruth, I had no idea you’ve been going through all of this. I’m so glad you are doing better. Thanks for catching up… Love, Mike


  3. robertjhawkins1
    August 31, 2019

    Thank you, Michael, for an interesting take on Garrison Keillor. I have been a fan of his writing and PHC since the late-1970s and was fortunate enough to interview him several times. I always found the man on stage to be a wholly separate character from the guy I interviewed. Still, for all the eccentricity, he was always a generous interview, giving me as much time and thought as needed to complete both of our assignments.
    I’m not qualified to pass judgment on Keillor’s behavior or the aspects that have been publicized — although I do have a Twitter account and a blog and that somehow emboldens me to pass judgment on virtually anything, like everybody else.
    I will say that I am still mystified by Keillor’s fall from grace. While I am grateful for the #metoo movement and the dealing of some long-overdue justice, Keillor’s complicity as a bad guy seems lacking. It feels like an angry/hungry pack went after the weakest animal in a herd of bad characters.
    For its part, I will always believe that MPR didn’t panic so much as saw a great opportunity to move aside an aging artifact and step onto the future with bright shiny new characters who would revitalize their crochety old — but affluent –donor base and attract Millenials and their parents. In a few words, they sacrificed their cash cow on the altar of delusion. I hope they paid dearly for it.
    Creative people have always been difficult. That is not an excuse and not a plea to hold them to different standards. But I think we need to try harder to separate the art from the artist and try to understand them both more fully before we hold lynching parties.
    Benvenuto Cellini was by all accounts, including his own, a despicable character. The man was a womanizer who liked killing his foes in duels, for god’s sake. I would never destroy his art or lock it in a museum cellar because of that.
    I think time will be reasonably kind to Keillor’s creative works. I don’t know that he can ever completely recover from the public humiliations. But I hope he does and I hope he keeps writing more such pieces like the one on public spaces in Harpers.
    Thank you, Garrison Keillor for decades of pleasure derived from your stage presence and your writing (your singing, maybe not so much — but very brave). I’m sorry you had to be a flawed human being to get there. Your flaws are my flaws and they are the flaws of all of us, men and women.
    The lesson here? We all suck at perfection.

    Liked by 2 people

  4. allisonfine
    August 13, 2019

    I’m one of the rare women with Asbergers. What a life! I am a writer, performer and musician. Writing is the prevailing vocation over many many years. Big Portfolio. Did an MFA but still searching for that elusive editor who loves and appreciate my “singular voice” as one professor said. I can totally relate to alienating people with my unwelcome insights! I have followed Keillor on Facebook and deigned to make comments, perhaps even offended him with my comments! I have mixed feelings about many of his “insights,” and his strong, white male authoritative stance. However, thank you for this article!

    Liked by 1 person

    • Vox Populi
      August 13, 2019

      Thanks, Alison!


      • larac7
        August 20, 2019

        Michael, have you heard of an author, poet, speaker writer, philanthropist named Millard Clark Faught (in the 1960s) .. He was incredibly waaaaaaaaaay ahead of his time in his writings and poetry and short humorous books. Nobody (I say NOBODY) has, can, or ever will MATCH the magnificant Garrison Keillor … however, the delightful Millard C. Faught (in my humble opinion) could be considered in the same general category. If you’d be interested, I’ll be happy to send you a collection of his delightful poems (which I have saved and protected like gold since the mid-1960s). The various subject matters in his poems vary tremendously which adds to my intense admiration of Millard Clark Faught. Clara Riley
        Phone: 956-756-1564

        Liked by 1 person

  5. Patricia A. Nugent
    August 12, 2019

    As always, you enlighten, Michael. Thanks for modeling authenticity. This storied essay addresses several complicated issues: how we manage being “different” in an unforgiving culture; how others manage us; the fine line between truth-telling and offending; finding the right vocation and avocation to match our strengths and minimize our shortcomings; not excusing inappropriate behavior if a disability is untreated; the intersection of genius and jerk. Anyone of these could become an essay unto itself. Keep going, Michael!


    • Vox Populi
      August 12, 2019

      Thanks, Patricia. I admire your summary of the issues brought up by the essay, and I especially like the phrase “the intersection of genius and jerk”. It sounds like the neighborhood where I grew up!

      Liked by 1 person

  6. Jim Peale
    August 11, 2019

    I’ve always been off-put by his evident hostility and contempt toward Unitarian-Universalists. I’m not sure Asperger’s/Autism is an excuse for that. I was a big fan of his humor before he went off the deep end on religion after his Danish sojourn.

    Liked by 1 person

  7. Helen Skarbek-Kwiatkowski
    August 11, 2019

    Thank you Michael for your thoughtful article on Garrison Keillor. For many years I looked forward to listening to Prairie Home Companion in my car during those long drives home from work late at night. Garrison had such a unique ability to make me feel that we were good friends sitting on a front porch under the stars just enjoying each others company. Of course, we never met, yet he was my good friend.

    Liked by 1 person

  8. dd1226comcastnet
    August 11, 2019

    I miss Prairie Home Companion and Garrison. He did a lot to bring accessible contemporary poetry to the masses through both his show and his anthology. I was surprised to find him “metoo-ed” and so thank you for this very candid explanation of the Aspergers spectrum. I also appreciate what you’ve done for poetry, Michael.

    Liked by 1 person

  9. daniel r. cobb
    August 11, 2019

    Michael, you’ve always been a helpful, thoughtful, and gentle soul with me. I’m a big fan, and I’m pretty picky. Your creativity and passion for this art of composition – endless.

    Liked by 1 person

  10. Andrea Hollander
    August 11, 2019

    Thank you for this thoughtful, revealing, and insightful article, Mike.

    Liked by 1 person

  11. jfrobb
    August 11, 2019

    Michael – Well done! As a (retired) psychologist who spent years working w/ parents of children 3-5 years old whose behaviors fell within that spectrum, I kept nodding my head and quietly saying Yes as I read this piece.
    Your words are a useful reminder to all of us about how Asperger’s syndrome plays out in adults, particularly for older adults who may have missed an enlightening diagnosis earlier in their lives.
    Though I have to add that your examples of things you’ve said in conversation that did not go well (and your editing exchanges) sounded like information those folks could perhaps have found useful to know.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Vox Populi
      August 11, 2019

      Thank you! Yes, often things I say that people find offensive are exactly what they need to hear. People love to shoot the messenger!


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